O-ringing barrels

[dyrberg123]

Hey Guys,

Anybody here with experience in cutting o ring gabs in their barrels?

Where to buy the O-rings, maybe web links, or even better material and dimention of the rings?

How Deep a groove should be cut, and where in the liner (close to inner wall or outer wall on middle)

I take that the Width of the groove is obviously same as the oring....

THX

[jeff kushner]

I would be interested in getting my 750 done too. I was planning on checking with a local machine shop since I've heard that many of them will do it.

Good luck finding someone and if you're happy with the results, post up so I can reach them too.
jeff

[dyrberg123]

I thought about doing the same myself, but i prefer learning how to my self

Well i have a lathe, toolbits to cut so they could make the right groove, but i need the info on my first postet questions to get any further, so come on Guys, you must know something. Sending them off to a machine shop is no challenge.....

[jeff kushner]

Why not ask someone who has actually done it....IRC reading a build thread that mentioned that when they exceeded 100HP at the rear wheel, they had head leakage issues.....I'll dig around for it and see if there is any contact info.....I'll let you know what I find.


jeff

[jeff kushner]

instructions:
http://www.bhjproducts.com/bhj_download ... nstrux.pdf" onclick="window.open(this.href);return false;

http://www.bhjproducts.com/bhj_content/ ... ng/org.php" onclick="window.open(this.href);return false;


Interesting development

http://www.hotrod.com/techarticles/engi ... to_03.html" onclick="window.open(this.href);return false;

I don't know how accurate this is:

"To my understanding o-ringing the block or the head prove to be about equally effective. That said I would say it depends if you want to have receiver grooves machined. The most conventional method is to machine and o-ring the block, then machine receiver grooves opposite the o-rings in the heads. I guess it can probably be done in reverse fashion as well.
As far as the receiver grooves are concerned, it not only helps in high compression and or boosted applications, but helps wet motors from losing fluid which is a common problem with copper head gaskets. It allows the o-ring to literally push the gasket into the receiver groove to provide a better seal. Speaking of copper gaskets here is a bit of info from SCE regarding this stuff;
O-ring grooves may be cut in either the block or cylinder head. When using copper head gaskets thinner than .050, O-ring height should be no more than 25% of gasket thickness. For instance, the proper dimensions for an .043 thick gasket using .041 wire would be; a .038 to .040 groove width (provides a .001 interference fit), and a .032 groove depth (leaves .008-.010 of the wire protruding above the deck). This machining can be done at most high performance machine shops

When receiver grooves are necessary, alignment of O-ring and receiver groove is critical, as is the depth and width of the receiver groove. Generally receiver groove depth should be 75% of the O-ring protrusion and the receiver groove should be 1.5 times the wire width. Example: If the O-ring is .041 wide and .015 above the deck; receiver groove should be .012 deep and .060 wide.

While the machining of O-ring and receiver grooves must be done by a machinist, the installation of the O-ring wire can be done by anyone, using common hand tools. When tapping O-ring wire into the groove, use care to avoid denting the wire. SCE provides an O-ring installation kit, (SCE PART #31542) which includes instructions, an installation tool and O-ring wire. When cutting stainless O-ring wire, file the ends square to provide the tightest possible seal."

O-Ring handbook!

http://www.logwell.com/tech/O-ring/Parker_Handbook.pdf" onclick="window.open(this.href);return false;


I hope this helps!!

jeff

[dyrberg123]

Hi Jeff,

Thanks alot, do you think it is the same conditions on a aircooled twostroke as on a hotrod for example?

I will read through the info during the weekend, and try to see what i find out!

[tz375]

Get 2 O rings from a TZ350 or TZ750 and cut a groove in the top face of the barrels the same way as the TZ. O ringing is common on Air cooled RD twins so it should also work on a T350

[dyrberg123]

Get 2 O rings from a TZ350 or TZ750 and cut a groove in the top face of the barrels the same way as the TZ. O ringing is common on Air cooled RD twins so it should also work on a T350

Thanks TZ

I already found those o rings on ebay this evening from fondseca. I need to search the center diameter of this groove and the width + depth.



Cheers

[jeff kushner]

FWIW, I spoke to Kelsey out at RK Tec today. He will build my GT750 head to my specs, o-ring, inserts, spark plugs centered, etc...for $400. I told him that there are two ways to do it either have him build the head then to have it locally machined once I have my block decked to compensate for the lift kit I'm installing or better, wait till I get that part done, then take the measurements and have him build it on the money the first time. We decided to go that route even though in will be 4-6 weeks before I'm to that point. Seems like the way to go for me anyway.

For those that want more info, give them a call:

http://www.2strokeheads.com/contact.htm" onclick="window.open(this.href);return false;

jeff

[Suzukidave]

Wow 400$ for all that head work is a great deal

[ja-moo]

That is a good price!

And Cryberg, McMaster carr has viton o rings cheap, My friend did his H2 heads for O rings and zero problems.

[jeff kushner]

Wow 400$ for all that head work is a great deal

I spoke with the guy for 15-20 minutes and he was completely familiar with our bikes engines. A lot of BS'ers I'm spoken with in the past month or so get lost when you mention the skewed transfers but he was on top of it. I had one "machinist" guy claim he had to install pistons from his KX250 cause he couldn't find aftermarket pistons. I asked how that worked for him and he said "great"!

Anyway, the only thing that we'll have to discuss further is the "inserts" part since I'm not sure how that's working in concert with centering the plugs but at least I've got a source with a great rep so I can trust them.

jeff

[Suzukidave]

I wonder if he is talking about inserts like this squish head of mine

[jeff kushner]

Did they build those for you or did you get them somewhere else? That's looks exactly like we were discussing!!

BTW- they look very nice indeed! How did they run?

jeff

[Suzukidave]

Years ago we had a list member offer up his help to have heads sent to him modded for custom made inserts like you see . Quite a few were made up but i am not really sure how many really got put into use . Mine is bolted to my reed engine that has not been started up yet so i cannot say for the performance . I believe WaterCooled has a insert squish head on his drag bike engine and it works well