This area always confuses me and never seems to be right - but it is functional What is the proper order of things? Right now the spanner nut is on top of the upper bearing. The boss on the spanner is facing up. Next is the dust shield which fits the boss on the spanner nut. Next would be the upper triple tree. But when assembled this way, the dust shield doesn't cover anything as can be seen in the second photo.
So I'm thinking maybe the dust shield goes on first and the spanner nut gets turned over the locate the dust shield. But assembled that way, the spanner nut is visible after assembly.- so that cant be right either. Also there is a recess on the bottom of the upper triple tree (3rd photo). What is that recess for? It doesn't seem to fit anything and is way smaller then the boss on the spanner nut.
So what is the proper way to assemble this mess? Neither way appears to be right nor follows any logic. HELP! Thanks!!
I was born with nothing and still have most of it left.
Pictures one and especially two are correct. Make sure the spanner nut is very tight, otherwise you will get bad head shake at higher speeds. A special tool can be used for that nut, called a spanner wrench. But, it's not necessarily needed. You can use a very wide flat head and hammer to tighten it. I would drimel out all of the powder coat in that recessed area under the tree. Will make everything a whole lot easier. Especially, the holes that hold the forks. Adding grease there makes installing forks a lot easier also.
Spanner wrench I have. Sold dozens on this forum. After reviewing the situation I think the error is due to the much taller assembled height of the tapered rollers as opposed to the OEM bearings. Not much I can really do about that. I guess I'll just have to live with it. Only other option would be shucking the tapered rollers and returning to the stock setup.
I was born with nothing and still have most of it left.
I believe you are correct. Both of my bikes have the original ball bearings. It's beyond unnecessary to replace them. Unless, a bike has sat for a long period at one time outdoors and the bearings or race rusted badly. That is rare as they should be packed in grease. I don't care who says what. The ball bearings don't wear. All you have to do is clean them and apply fresh grease. Bearings on a motorcycle head stock don't see enough usage to require replacing them unless a triple tree or the head stock stem nut was not torqued correctly at one time. But, that's too is rare. When I restored my 750. The grease as expected was very dirty. I cleaned the bearings, applied fresh grease and the steering was good as new. I did drop and lose 2, but I replaced them with used ones sold on Ebay from a Honda CB 750. All Jap bikes from the 70's use the same size head stock ball bearings. If the original ball bearings will roll across a flat surface. They are good to go.
Last edited by pearljam724 on Thu Dec 18, 2014 6:16 pm, edited 1 time in total.
PJ,
I agree with what you posted with the proviso that maybe in the UK it rains more and all three of the GTs who's headstock bearings I attended to has rusty balls with flats on from lack of lube and two of three had badly notched races. One bike would not ride straight, one wouldn't corner well, one seemed OK ish (all before the work).
Since I decided to replace the set up with new, I chose tapered rollers, but I don't disagree that I don't notice them being 'better than stock' now they're in. Good though!
Coyote - there should be no meaningful increase in height with those tapers. On all 3 of mine, I found I needed to narrow the steering stem for 15mm further down - just using emory cloth - to allow the upper bearing to slide fully home. I wonder if you'd made that modification? If not done, the stock headlamp brackets will rattle and not be held firmly between the yokes.
I put the tapered bearings in mine as well, and mine looks just like yours, I ended up leaving the dust cover off, not sure if that's ok or not but like you said the cover didn't cover anything, its been a couple of years now and it seems ok, but like I said before once in a while it seems it gets a little loose, or maybe its just me being paranoid? I tried to tighten it a week ago and it seemed fine, not loose. There was a space in the headlight bucket brace and lower chrome cover but I used a O-ring to take up the small gap, and its fine and you cant even notice it. I tried posting a pic but it said emp or emb not available? not sure but I will try again.. also my stem was machined exactly like the directions from all-balls said so I left it at that, I even talked to one of the reps from all balls and he said this was normal, so that's why I left mine the way it was, which is just like yours. I put tapered bearings in because my bearings were also shot, rusted and the race had gouges or dips in it, I guess the bike spent years outside in the rain, but the race was more damaged than the bearings, bearings were rusted, and I live in the desert but we do have a monsoon season.
Yes, the stem has been machined down for bearing clearance. It is not bottoming out on the stem. I am sure of that as it was machined about 1/2" further. The only thing I did different was I added the bearing shields that came in the kit. Together they were just .060 (1.5mm) so I wasn't worried about a lot of extra stacked height.
You know on these kits, when they list the compatible GT's, the 76 and 77 are not listed. Good through 75. I took it upon myself to decide there surely wasn't any frame changes made in the last 2 years. I don't know why, but maybe the frame neck was actually shorter by a little in 76 and 77.?
I just looked and I see the stem is bottoming out on the outside of the bearing shields. That would account for a good 1/4" in assembly height. I need to take those out. Might be a bear on the bottom bearing. It was tight! I had to drift it on. Too bad there is no way to drift it off.
PJ, I have nothing against the stock bearings. When I rebuilt my GS1000 I replaced the bearings with stock. Balls had flats and the races notched. Tapered bearings weren't the thing in 95 so I put all new OEM stuff in. It still works perfectly. Silky smooth and not notchy like it was when I got it.
But now it's actually cheaper to go with the aftermarket tapered bearings.The four OEM races and 36 balls is $66.00 - and that's discounted. I think I gave around $19 for the whole set in 95.
I was born with nothing and still have most of it left.
Coyote wrote:Yes, the stem has been machined down for bearing clearance. It is not bottoming out on the stem. I am sure of that as it was machined about 1/2" further. The only thing I did different was I added the bearing shields that came in the kit. Together they were just .060 (1.5mm) so I wasn't worried about a lot of extra stacked height.
You know on these kits, when they list the compatible GT's, the 76 and 77 are not listed. Good through 75. I took it upon myself to decide there surely wasn't any frame changes made in the last 2 years. I don't know why, but maybe the frame neck was actually shorter by a little in 76 and 77.?
I just looked and I see the stem is bottoming out on the outside of the bearing shields. That would account for a good 1/4" in assembly height. I need to take those out. Might be a bear on the bottom bearing. It was tight! I had to drift it on. Too bad there is no way to drift it off.
PJ, I have nothing against the stock bearings. When I rebuilt my GS1000 I replaced the bearings with stock. Balls had flats and the races notched. Tapered bearings weren't the thing in 95 so I put all new OEM stuff in. It still works perfectly. Silky smooth and not notchy like it was when I got it.
But now it's actually cheaper to go with the aftermarket tapered bearings.The four OEM races and 36 balls is $66.00 - and that's discounted. I think I gave around $19 for the whole set in 95.
I agree 100%. I have a 1950 Chevy car that had it's original wheel ball bearings that are like our bikes head stock to a large degree. I did buy tapered bearings for it. Only because they were nearly a hundred dollars cheaper. The original ball bearings for that car are available. But, they cost a mint. So, it was a no brainer. Being aftermarket tapered bearings were available for a hundred dollars cheaper. I could have saved even more. Had I found the problem with wheel slop sooner. Rather, than crowning the problem automatically to the bearings. Turned out, the original ball bearings were fine. After I installed the tapered bearings. I found two bolts that were loose as hell. Those bolts held the steering knuckle, that attached to the tie rods causing the wheel slop. But, it was too late. I had paid for the tapered bearings months prior and already installed them. So, to lessen the pain. I convinced myself that " They were 65 years old. "
Last edited by pearljam724 on Thu Dec 18, 2014 6:50 pm, edited 1 time in total.
yeadon_m wrote:PJ,
I agree with what you posted with the proviso that maybe in the UK it rains more and all three of the GTs who's headstock bearings I attended to has rusty balls with flats on from lack of lube and two of three had badly notched races. One bike would not ride straight, one wouldn't corner well, one seemed OK ish (all before the work).
Since I decided to replace the set up with new, I chose tapered rollers, but I don't disagree that I don't notice them being 'better than stock' now they're in. Good though!
Coyote - there should be no meaningful increase in height with those tapers. On all 3 of mine, I found I needed to narrow the steering stem for 15mm further down - just using emory cloth - to allow the upper bearing to slide fully home. I wonder if you'd made that modification? If not done, the stock headlamp brackets will rattle and not be held firmly between the yokes.
Cheers,
Mike
I agree, Mike. Notched races and odd shaped ball bearings are caused by an incorrect torque of the stem nut. It does happen. If torque settings are correct, parts are rust free, clean and greased. They should last forever. But, that's in a perfect world.
Well, what do you know? I took a bunch of photos before tearing down my totally stock 76 GT550. I was looking back through them and I ran across this photo. SmokeyAllan is correct. The spanner nut IS installed small end down. He is right that all the fiches are incorrect. This proves that point!
I was born with nothing and still have most of it left.
wow! that's good to know!, my gt750 never had the dust cover to begin with , it was missing when I bought the bike, when I put the tapered bearings in I was going to locate one but I just left it off and didn't find one. I also went by the parts fiche so now I have a question, do I need to flip mine? I don't have that dust cover and it seems ok for now? I know this sounds like a stupid question but mine has been flipped for about 2 or 3 years now
I wouldn't worry about it if you don't have a dust cover to locate. However, for under $7.00 I think the dust cover would be a wise purchase. Part number 51643-30000. $6.68 at Partzilla.
I was born with nothing and still have most of it left.
well I got it from bike bandit, I had some credit with them, this explains why the races were so rusted, bike must have sat outside for years without that cover. I thought it was odd the way the parts fiche had it, but I went by that , ohh well , now I have another project, glad you posted this!!!
